Subject: The Gospel according to ARD:

From: John Lawson <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun Mar 30 18:33:01 2003

Tony Duell provides us with an exemplary indicator of the true
collector:

>
>and give you a nasty (and possibly fatal) shock, or worse still do
                                                  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>serious damage to said classic computer.
>

  Collectors are many; vintage computers, few!

   ;}

 Cheers

 John One-Hand-In-Back-Pocket-At-All-Times Lawson

---

From: [email-masked] (Tony Duell)
Date: Mon Mar 31 17:34:57 2003

>   Tony Duell provides us with an exemplary indicator of the true

Since when have I been a collector, true or otherwise? It is not my aim 
to own one of every version of a particular machine, I don't care about 
original boxes, if I get shrink-wrapped manuals, I unwrap them (manuals 
are for reading!), very few (if any) of my machines are 'original'. All 
that surely means I am not a collector.

> >and give you a nasty (and possibly fatal) shock, or worse still do

Of course... 

>  John One-Hand-In-Back-Pocket-At-All-Times Lawson

A _very_ good idea!. Never work on high voltage stuff with both hands -- 
you don't want the current to flow through your heart. And make sure 
there's somebody around who knows how to turn everything off if you _do_ 
accidentally connect yourself to the mains.

-tony

---

From: "R. D. Davis" <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon Mar 31 20:21:00 2003

> that surely means I am not a collector.

Are you sure? :-) That would mean that I'm not a collector either.
However, if I'm not a collector, why then am I collecting interesting
machines at random to use and modify... and, of course, preserve.  I
don't care about having one version of every machine, the machine's
appearance, superficial mechanical damage, etc.  If it's repairable
(e.g. - multilayer circuit boards not broken in two), looks
interesting, has interesting circuitry, does something that I need it
to do, has the potential for interesting modifications, etc., then
it's a good candidate for my collection.  If it's not repairable
(e.g., smashed circuit board and various bits missing), then perhaps I
can use bits of it for other things (computer related or with other
circuitry).  Historical significance, and preservation, are of
interest to me, but I still feel that what's most important is using
the machine, even if that requires modifying it.  Why should some
"collectors" and museums object to usage and modification?  Are not
such modifications themselves an example of what people were doing
with technology at a certain point in time, and good examples of how
machines could be used?

> accidentally connect yourself to the mains.

...and let's not forget the feet, etc.  Keeping one hand in the pocket
won't help if one is standing barefoot in a puddle of water or leaning
against a grounded object.  Drinking from the garden hose while
repairing a live HV supply, for example, is not a good idea... not
that anyone on this list would do such a thing, but surely, somewhere,
someone (most likely a sports fan (e.g., "duh, uh, let's watch
footbawl or go play golf ...we ain't no *&$%#@*! intuhlechtuals") who
likes Micro$oft products, and has just enough electronics knowledge to
be dangerous) is doing such a thing as we think "no one would do
that!"

-- 
Copyright (C) 2002 R. D. Davis The difference between humans & other animals: 
All Rights Reserved            an unnatural belief that we're above Nature & 
[email-masked]  410-744-4900  her other creatures, using dogma to justify such
http://www.rddavis.org         beliefs and to justify much human cruelty.

---

From: [email-masked] (Tony Duell)
Date: Tue Apr 1 17:58:57 2003

> Are you sure? :-) That would mean that I'm not a collector either.

Well, I don;t think you are a collector....

> machines at random to use and modify... and, of course, preserve.  I

Oh, you're a hacker (in the true, original sense), an enthusiast, a 
high-mass-hobbyist, a preservationist, whatever. 

> don't care about having one version of every machine, the machine's

I only want other versions if there are real differences (extra features, 
major redesign of some circuits, etc). I am not interested in having 
every known version of the nameplate...

The HP80 financial calculator is a case in point. Collectors tell me 
there are all sorts of versions -- things like does the nameplate read 
'Hewlett Packard' or 'Hewlett Packard 80'. I claim there are 2 important 
versions -- the early one with a hybrid circuit for the ROM, and the 
later one with ROMs in DIP packages (and IIRC, the circuit board is 
similar to that from an HP45 then). I care about what's inside the case.

> interest to me, but I still feel that what's most important is using

Agreed. I don't like making changes for no good reason. If I can get the 
right part to repair a machine (meaning a modern replacement which is 
electrically and mechanically the same) then I'll use it. If I can't, 
though, I'd rather get something that will work than have a non-working 
machine. Of coruse I make as few changes as possible, don't do anything 
that can't be reversed if the original part does turn up, and document 
what I've done.

-tony

---

From: Benjamin Gardiner <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri Apr 4 17:53:00 2003

Trust me about getting electrocuted across the arms isnt fun..

I used to work as an electrician (mainly doing data & communications) 
and I got 415 Volts across the arms, from a faulty telecoms board, 
needless to say it was not fun ;) it stopped my heart, burnt my arms, 
and blew a piece of bone out of the bottom of my hand...

Luckly, my co worker, knew how to get me off the board, and keep me 
going till the ambulance arived, and other than a scar on my hand now 7 
years later I am fine....

Benjamin

-- 
one you lock the target
two you bait the line
three you slowly spread the net
and four you catch the man

Front 242 Headhunter

---

From: [email-masked] (Tony Duell)
Date: Fri Apr 4 18:43:01 2003

> Trust me about getting electrocuted across the arms isnt fun..

I can well believe it. 240V between fingers on one hand isn't _fun_ either...

A true story to show that all of us can be clueless. I spent a weekend at 
home repairing a  VT100 PSU. This is a switch-mode device. and quite a 
bit of the circuitry is not isolated from the power line. I took a lot of 
care, and amazingly got it working without electrocuting myself.

Then I went into work. There was a little +/-15V linear PSU that was 
malfunctioning, so I decided to have a go a fixing it. A nice, simple, 
PSU with almost all the circuitry on the output side of the transformer. 
Took it apart, quickly traced the fault, soldered in a new pass 
transistor. Seemed to work fine, so I started to put it back together. 

What a pity I forgot to uplug it from the mains. As I picked up the rear 
panel to put it back in place, my fingers reached round the edge of it 
and came into contact with the tags on the mains fuseholder. So I had 
mains between said fingers and the rest of my hand holding the grounded 
panel. Hurt like hell I can tell you!

-tony