Subject: Re: Mac G5 / moving to OS X

From: Seth Lewin <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon Jul 21 16:17:57 2003

>> If your a current mac user the g5 WILL be alot faster then what you
> have,
>> if your an Intel user I dont see a rush to buy anything made by apple.
> If 
>> your a unix geek you might want a G5 just to say you own one and make
>> fellow geeks unworthy of your presence.
> 
>> The funny thing is mac users who laugh at PC guys upgrading their
> hardware
>> every year are now doing the same thing, except its alot more costly
> for
>> them buying complete new machines while PC users just chuck the
>> motherboard/ram/video card in their old rig. This upgrade cycle of
>> hardware will eventually kill the mac market because only the very
> rich
>> can keep up.  What percentage of mac owners are using OSX? What
> percentage 
>> will upgrade to a current OSX running machine anytime soon?

That's not quite the case.  Macs have a considerably longer useful life than
PCs, generally, and are indeed upgradeable. I just took my January 1999
model Blue G3/400 desktop, swapped the 8.5 GB Ultra2Wide SCSI disk subsystem
for a fast 200 gig Maxtor and an ATA 133 card, slipped in an 800 mhz G3 CPU
daughtercard and installed a Radeon 7000 instead of the OEM Rage 128 and a
LiteOn 52x CDROM instead of the old Matushita 24x (I already have an
external 1394 burner) and a Kensington 3-button Studio Mouse.  Runs OS 10.26
like a charm. Sure a G5 would  be faster but this setup handles a heavy duty
OS10.26 without any strain, web pages render in a flash etc. Plus this one
will still boot OS9 directly and I can use my old ADB keyboard of which I'm
fond. I figure on getting a year or two more out of this machine by which
time I may just buy a laptop and use the G3 for a file and web server. I
would've LIKED a new machine, but didn't NEED one.  Of the four households
in this immediate family 3 are on OS X; only my 87 year old father in law
doesn't want to upgrade his 1998 rev A iMac and install it. That's 75%
penetration. Also the G3/400 daughtercard I removed is now installed in what
was formerly a Beige G3/266  I keep at work as a scanning station. That
leaves me with a spare ZIF G3/266 daughtercard. Anybody need one?

Seth Lewin

---

From: "Stan" <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon Jul 21 16:26:51 2003

Hi Joe,

The only reason that I can come up with for HP's construction techniques is
that their IC's were made during the heyday of HP's own IC division. They
overbuilt everything, probably because of reliability concerns. Other people
certainly will know more about this than I do, but I think that HP was one
of the earliest developers/fabricators of ECL.

Thanks in advance for the manual!

Regards,
Stan

Hi Stan,

  Thanks for the info. Any idea whey the fancy construction? I've dealt
with ECL before but never seen anything like this.

  BTW I'm made copies of that memory board manual for you. It's packed and
ready to ship. I'll try to drop it off at the post office today.

   Joe

At 08:21 PM 7/17/03 -0700, you wrote:
>Hi Joe,
>
>The 05370-60022 part number IDs this as the Arming Board from the HP
5370A/B
>counter. The 1820-0753 is an ECL dual 3-input gate, the 1820-1999 is a
>multiplexer, and the 1820-2000 is a D flip-flop. These are all ECL IC's,
and
>on each of them the two end pins are connected to the substrate and tied to
>the -5.2 V bus. These two pins act as both power input and heat sinks for
>the chip.
>
>Stan
>
>Message: 3
>Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2003 15:54:54
>To: [email-masked]
>From: Joe <[email-masked]>
>Subject: Re: Can anyone id these HP ICs? (Joe)
>Reply-To: [email-masked]
>
>   Bingo! You're right. It's part number is 05370-60022. I had tried to
>look up that number but all I found was a scanner with the same PN. Do you
>have a service manual for this? If so, can you tell me what these parts
>are? PNs 1820-0753, 1820-2000 and 1820-1999.
>
>   Joe
>
>At 10:55 AM 7/15/03 -0700, you wrote:
>>Hi Joe,
>>
>>Your board looks like one of the interpolator cards from an HP 5370A
>Universal Time Interval Counter. Do you see an "05370-6xxxx" part number on
>the board anywhere?
>>
>>
>>Message: 14
>>Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2003 17:52:26
>>To: [email-masked]
>>From: Joe <[email-masked]>
>>Subject: Re: Can anyone id these HP ICs?
>>Reply-To: [email-masked]
>>
>>Hi Ed,
>>
>>  I posted a picture at
>><http://home.cfl.rr.com/rigdon14/t-bird/hp-ic.jpg>.
>>I unplugged the two ICs in the top RH corner and turned them over so that
>>you can see the bottom and side of the ICs and the heat sink that the IC
>>normally sits on. There is a depression in the bottom of the IC case and a
>>rasied pad on the heatsink that fits into the depression. I've never seen
>>anything like this before! Note the delay line (?) on the LH side of the
>>card. Sorry I couldn't get a better picture. This is as close as I could
>>get with my camera.
>>
>>   Joe
>
>-- __--__--

--__--__--

---

From: "TeoZ" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue Jul 22 19:07:47 2003

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Seth Lewin" <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Sent: Friday, July 18, 2003 4:30 PM
Subject: Re: Mac G5 / moving to OS X

> leaves me with a spare ZIF G3/266 daughtercard. Anybody need one?

That machine was already OSX compatible and is still supported. My much
older PM8500 with 448mb ram, G3-400/1mb, usb card, acard 66 with 40x IDE
cdrom and 60gb 7200 rpm HD , ultimaterez 8mb video card can run OSX via
xpostfacto and is much older then your machine. I use it for OS 9.1 which it
runs very fast and have no plans on getting an OSX supported machine. Most
of the people I know who collect macs collect the 68k machines and have a
few PCI era machines also, and they all run either A/UX, linux, or macos.
Old PC's have a decent user life if you want to run the older dos/windows
3.x/win95 apps. While I think a G5 would be interesting to mess with (and
alot of people think the same) I dont see anybody I talk to even thinking
about buying one anytime soon. These same people upgrade their PC's every
year or 2.

I see alot of people trying to run Windows XP on real old hardware where it
runs like crap, just like alot of people trying to run OSX on hardware where
it runs very slow. I like to run the OS that is  most productive for the
hardware.

---

From: Tom Uban <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue Jul 22 19:25:15 2003

Hi Seth,

I'm curious if you bought those upgrades new, and what they cost?

--tnx
--tom

---

From: "John Ruschmeyer" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue Jul 22 19:31:18 2003

Actually, I was wondering what you did with the leftover Rage 128.

<<<John>>>

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email-masked] [mailto:[email-masked]]On
> Behalf Of Seth Lewin
> Sent: Friday, July 18, 2003 4:31 PM
> That